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 Post subject: Ignition/airbag issues
PostPosted: Mon Jul 25, 2016 6:22 pm 
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Location: Canada
Hello everyone I hope this post works, it's my first time. I recently bought a standard 1995 pontiac firefly with 262,000km on it 3 cylinder 1.0L engine. Amazing car, was told the engine and clutch have been replaced 60,000km ago. Of course I had to run into a problem eventually right? Well the first thing that failed was my ignition. No matter how many times I jiggled the steering wheel or moved the key around, it would not turn. I spoke to GM and several parts stores in town along with a couple locksmiths, they all pointed tumblers inside the ignition, and all said it was an unservicable part. So I bought an aftermarket ignition and cut all the original wiring to my old ignition and wired it in. I have basic wiring knowledge and was able to identify all but 2 wires that went into the original ignition. I really wish I knew how to add pictures as I would show you the original ignition switch. The 2 unidentified wires that went into my ignition are black and a black/white strip. I know the solid black wire is constant ground verified it with a test light, however the black/white wire only receives ground when the ignition switch is in the start position, as in the vehicle is being started, and then receives no power after the vehicle is started and you release the key. I have a feeling this wire has something to do with my airbag system, as my airbag light is now on. However I may have damaged my clock spring taking off my steering wheel still have to verify the clock spring is working. I also thought it had something to do with the key left in the ignition buzzer, but I found those wires and the buzzer still works as normal. I was able to find this article online
http://metroxfi.com/wp-content/uploads/ ... t_1995.pdf

If you scroll down to page 22 it shows a black/white wire coming from the fuse box (which is where the wire from my ignition goes to), then it goes straight to the SDM box for the airbag system. So it got me thinking, I temporarily connected the solid ground to the black/white while I started the motor, the air bag light still came on, flashed 7 times, and then stayed on. So which leads me to believe I either, a) have got this wire mixed up and it goes somewhere different, or b) I first need to somehow reset my airbag system so I can clear the code before it will recognize that the system is working(yes I tried disconnecting my battery for awhile with no luck). Does anyone have any experience with this issue? Thanks a lot for your time.


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 25, 2016 7:03 pm 
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Location: Vancouver BC
Strange that black/white wire appears twice in the SDM pinout. Ground wire in pin 10 is marked black/white as well as another black/white wire to IGN pin 4 .

That can't be right. Will check this later tonight using a paper factory manual source


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 26, 2016 12:43 am 
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Thanks for the reply Suzukitom! I took a couple minutes just for curiosity sake to scroll through the other wiring diagrams. Black/white seems to be a common wire color for these cars. On page 8 there is a black/white wire that also goes to the noise suppressor (center of safety wall). No idea what a noise suppressor is on a car other then a muffler, but those aren't wired to my knowledge. On page 7 there is also a bl/wh wire going to the O2 sensor... wow they really like this wire color combo...

all I know for sure is this wire from the ignition only receives a brief amount of power as the engine is being started, once you release the key, this wire receives no power, AND I know it travels from the ignition to the fuse box

would like to also get the airbag working too but parts are a lot harder to find on these cars then my 1995 acura integra, worst case scenario is I have to do a airbag delete.


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 26, 2016 1:48 am 
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I'm currently studying the wiring diagrams.. will post shortly..


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 26, 2016 2:54 am 
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There are 5 ignition switch positions: Lock, Off, Acc, On/Run, Start

According to diagrams on pages P-14,P-16, and P-22 of the PDF file link you provided, there should be 6 Wires from the ignition switch to corresponding coloured wires at the junction block (fuse box) located under the dash.


Black: To Ground

White - From +12V Hot at all times - originate from the 60A Main Fuse in Engine compartment

Blue/Red stripe: Ignition Switch - *Accessory and On/Run* positions: to Radio Fuse

Red/Yellow stripe: Ignition Switch - *Start* position: to Clutch Pedal Safety Start switch. (depress clutch to engage starter)

Blue/Black stripe: Ignition Switch: Hot in *On/Run and Start* positions: to Wiper/Washer Fuse, Backup lights, Turn signals, Combination Meter (instruments), Engine Controls, engine fuel and the ignition system. Then, the Black/White stripe wire from the junction block will have +12V whenever the ignition switch is in the *On/Run or Start* positions.


Red/Green: Ignition Switch: Hot in *On/Run* position: Window Defogger/ABS Module Fuse (also connected to Blower Motor/AC Fuse at Junction block)

The noise suppressor you mentioned is an electronic component in the ignition circuit and reduces electrical noise.


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 26, 2016 3:17 am 
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Since your main action was to replace your ignition switch with another one, you should not assume that either of the 2 Black/White wires shown in the air bag black box circuit (SDM) on P-22 of the PDF file are identical. One of the wires marked Black with White stripe is a ground (connected to G203 ground location), the other wire also marked Black with White stripe appears to be hot when the IGN is on. You should not have to do anything involving the SDM wiring as a result of replacing the ignition switch.

Suzuki seems to have an unfortunate occasional habit of using the same coloured wire if it thinks that the wire is being used in an isolated circuit. (or it may be an error in the diagram. You can check whether there are actually 2 black with white stripe wires in the SDM wire connector.)

A last comment tonight - have you considered a used ignition switch from a wrecking yard? It shouldn't be that hard to find one, and using one could probably save you the effort of rewiring/bypassing the factory switch/lock.


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 26, 2016 10:03 am 
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I did consider it, but all the models at the wreckers didn't have keys. But it's a little late for that considering I've already rewired and added my new ignition. Is there anything more in the wiring diagram for this black white wire? My reason for believing it was involved in the airbag is a) I had the airbag light on my dash which wasn't there before and b) isn't there a circuit in the vehicle that shuts off the airbag when your vehicle is off, so that it doesn't deploy if your car gets hit while it's parked? If there is then I'm assuming there would need to be a circuit to provide a couple seconds of power to 'jump start' the SDM system?

It's funny cause the car runs fine without this wire hooked up, but I still don't feel like the job has been 100% completed I don't know what it does or how to hook it up, new ignition has all positive leads on it and there is no spot for any negative wires.

Does it say in that manual how to reset the airbag codes without a plug and play scanner tool?


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 26, 2016 2:12 pm 
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Quote:
Is there anything more in the wiring diagram for this black white wire? My reason for believing it was involved in the airbag is a) I had the airbag light on my dash which wasn't there before and


There are 2 black/white wires to the SDM. One of them will depend on the ignition switch position. When the ignition is turned to the On/Run or Start position, the Black/white stripe wire from the junction box Air Bag Fuse should now have +12V. This Black/white wire goes from the junction block to your SDM pin 4 (marked as Ignition input). The other Black/White wire from the SDM pin 10 is a dedicated ground wire - it is probably a short wire that goes to a metal ring bolted to the car sheet metal. If the SDM pin 4 does not receive the expected voltage when you turn the ignition on, the air bag light will flash 7 times, and then remain steady on with no DTCs set. So you should check if your Air Bag fuse is blown.

Quote:
b) isn't there a circuit in the vehicle that shuts off the airbag when your vehicle is off, so that it doesn't deploy if your car gets hit while it's parked? If there is then I'm assuming there would need to be a circuit to provide a couple seconds of power to 'jump start' the SDM system?


Your SIR system requires ignition to be on to be active. However, The SDM retains electrical energy reserve of about 10 minutes even if all sources of battery power are disabled.


Quote:
Does it say in that manual how to reset the airbag codes without a plug and play scanner tool?


I don't think you have any DTC codes to reset, do you? You mentioned the air bag light is steady on, after flashing 7 times. This means the SDM did not get the expected 12v to its PIN 4 ignition input.


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 24, 2016 2:52 am 
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The noise suppressor you mentioned is an electronic component in the ignition circuit and reduces electrical noise.
คาสิโนเกมส์สด


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