TeamSwift

Home of the Suzuki mini-compacts ! Your Home for all things Suzuki Swift, Geo Metro, Holden Barina, Chevy Sprint, Pontiac Firefly, and Suzuki Cultus. TeamSwift is a technical performance oriented community!
It is currently Sat Aug 19, 2017 4:21 am

Underbody braces, turbos and more!

All times are UTC - 5 hours




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 96 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4
Author Message
 Post subject: Re: Racing battery
PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2012 12:36 pm 
Offline

Joined: Mon Mar 14, 2005 10:19 am
Posts: 361
Location: Canberra, Australlia
Teeth wrote:
Quote:
rarely go above 5,000 rpms


I'd say you're not risking enough :wink:

I suppose hypermiling requires as much attention to weight savings as racing :roll: but otherwise there's no reason to try that hard.

I've had mine long enough to stop worrying about it though--so far there isn't any difference except a brighter dome light, faster cranking, and less weight.


And no coming back to car after few weeks to find battery is flat.

_________________
ImageET 13.138 at 120.2mph


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Racing battery
PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 11:23 pm 
Offline

Joined: Fri Jan 01, 2010 8:49 pm
Posts: 95
Location: Alabama
suprf1y wrote:
I have left the amp on in my car by accident twice while working on it. The first time the battery went down to 3V, and I was able to charge it back no problem. The second time, I left the charger on too long, and one of the cells split. From what I've read, I'm lucky I didn't burn the car to the ground :shock:

Now I'm using the 4 cell from my bike and so far it's working. I imagine it won't once the weather cools down.

Image

Do you have a source for this battery?


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Racing battery
PostPosted: Wed Jan 16, 2013 6:09 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Dec 05, 2010 5:56 pm
Posts: 1023
Location: Wahiawa, HI
Battery DOA today.

Left it in airport parking for two weeks in Las Vegas and forgot to disconnect it, but that didn't seem to be a problem as the car started right up when we got back.

After we got home I decided, after a couple of days of the car just sitting there, that it wouldn't be moving for a while again anyway, so I disconnected it. I put the car up on jack stands to mess with my leaking exhaust header for what I hope is the last time and when I took it back down to fire it up, no juice.

I don't know if I left a dome light on (don't think so) so I don't know what's going on but battery shows no signs of overheating even though there was NOTHING when I turned the key. It's on the 2a charger now and appears to be taking a charge, so we'll see how this goes...

_________________
Quote:
No one expects the Spanish Inquisition!

Spanish Inquisition Racing chip burning service--build yourself a custom chip!
http://www.teamswift.net/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=57216


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Racing battery
PostPosted: Wed Jan 16, 2013 11:03 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Dec 05, 2010 5:56 pm
Posts: 1023
Location: Wahiawa, HI
Um, well, I still don't know what drained the battery :huh:

But I think I can stop worrying about setting the car on fire if I leave my lights on. Or ruin the battery.

Who knows if I've taken some life off of it, but once obviously won't kill it because I charged it up with my 2ah charger, popped it back in and the car fired right up :D :D

Also no signs of having been hot either, and it was quite flat when I pulled it out of the car. Should have tested it.

I'll have to make sure I keep it disconnected at night for a while to make sure, then I'll leave it for a few days and watch closely to see if I see if I've got a drain somewhere. The quick disconnect is only cool if it is a convenience, not if it is a necessity....

_________________
Quote:
No one expects the Spanish Inquisition!

Spanish Inquisition Racing chip burning service--build yourself a custom chip!
http://www.teamswift.net/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=57216


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Mar 16, 2013 12:02 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Dec 05, 2010 5:56 pm
Posts: 1023
Location: Wahiawa, HI
For any remaining skeptics:

This battery is still relatively new, but I've put some miles on it and I've accidentally drained it flat which was supposed to be a big no-no according to the research. Most recently we were coming back from an autocross event in Utah when we ran into NASCAR fan traffic leaving the event in Las Vegas on the way home. 10 mile long parking lot. I forgot about the underdrive pulley, because I guess I am an idiot. :blackeye:

The car dies on the interstate and I have to get a push start from the people behind us, but even drawing the battery to nearly dead, it ran the car at near idle for well over an hour before it gave up, then charged right back up and started the car again with no issues by Primm at the California line.

I was stoked to slowly pass a dude driving a Mk3 Geo 3 door. Nice ratty example with nasty stickers, hood pins :thumbsup: and a little bitty tach. I asked him if it was a boost gauge. He asked me if mine was running right. I mumbled something about underdrive pulley and kept goosing the throttle.

I let some people that were walking by ride on the trailer--they got off again and explained that they were worried that I'd go too fast when everybody speeded up, then walked ahead of us and vanished, as we averaged maybe three 3 mph for ten miles :cry:

Battery seems fine. If you have an underdrive pulley, don't forget that your batter will die if you are stuck in traffic for hours on end...

_________________
Quote:
No one expects the Spanish Inquisition!

Spanish Inquisition Racing chip burning service--build yourself a custom chip!
http://www.teamswift.net/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=57216


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Racing battery
PostPosted: Sat Mar 16, 2013 10:21 am 
Offline
Moderator
Moderator
User avatar

Joined: Sun Feb 23, 2003 4:16 am
Posts: 8018
Location: Ontario, Canada
That little one is still sitting in my car since I put it away for the winter. I should have a look and see if it still has any charge.

_________________
Contact 3tech: g10pro@rocketmail.com


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Racing battery
PostPosted: Tue Mar 19, 2013 5:12 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sat Nov 19, 2005 4:12 pm
Posts: 167
Location: Ten Boer, Groningen, Netherlands
What about this one:
Image

12v AGM 4Ah. 1.7Kg
Best thing is price, i have this battery delivered for only 20 euro's.. that is like 25 USD.

I can buy 5 of these for the price of one of those A123 lithium batteries.

Only thing is, will it work ok? Wont it be overcharged by the altenator?


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Racing battery
PostPosted: Tue Mar 19, 2013 6:15 pm 
Offline
Moderator
Moderator
User avatar

Joined: Sun Feb 23, 2003 4:16 am
Posts: 8018
Location: Ontario, Canada
Looks like a motorcycle battery. The A123 battery in my car now was $44

_________________
Contact 3tech: g10pro@rocketmail.com


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Racing battery
PostPosted: Tue Mar 19, 2013 7:31 pm 
Offline

Joined: Mon Mar 14, 2005 10:19 am
Posts: 361
Location: Canberra, Australlia
All compromises. 8 cell A123 battery is 6.9Ah and voltage is 13.2v. So yes yours is cheaper but I don't believe it will last as long as the LiFePO4 types. Especially for a track car where once disconnected the LiFePO4 style batteries lose charge very very slowly.

For the price though don't let us stop you and let us all know how it goes.

_________________
ImageET 13.138 at 120.2mph


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Racing battery
PostPosted: Thu Apr 11, 2013 6:07 am 
Offline
Teamswift Racer
User avatar

Joined: Fri Apr 02, 2004 5:56 am
Posts: 2322
Location: Christchurch NZ, quake capital
Well after 2 years of racing vibration, cold weather starting and numerous times I've let it run dead flat my 'dewalt' battery gave up today.

Just dropped the car off to get dyno'ed and the battery was dead flat, forgot to turn off the battery isolate switch again, jump started it off my work car ok and left the swift running, went to my first job for the day and 20 mins later the dyno guy rings me to say that when he switched off the ignition the battery was making a squealing sound and is now smoking :shock: despite turning the battery isolate switch off... anyway he managed to unbolt it and take it out of the car, melted the paint off the bottom of my car :evil: should be thankful he noticed it I suppose...

Have gone back to my heavy 5kg lead acid battery for a few months until I can afford to buy a 12cell battery, my 8 cell one started the car fine but I think a bit of extra fire starting capacity would be good :mrgreen:


Attachments:
2013-04-11 13.53.04.jpg
2013-04-11 13.53.04.jpg [ 83.95 KIB | Viewed 1983 times ]
2013-04-11 13.53.17.jpg
2013-04-11 13.53.17.jpg [ 71.57 KIB | Viewed 1983 times ]
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Racing battery
PostPosted: Tue Dec 10, 2013 3:10 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Dec 05, 2010 5:56 pm
Posts: 1023
Location: Wahiawa, HI
A quick update:

I have been living with the larger A123 battery in a car that gets some reasonable street use for a long time now without any problems--but I do live in the battery-friendly desert of Southern California. If any of you Canucks are actually using this thing in the Frozen North you're getting better results than I am. It's been unseasonably chilly here (ever so slightly below freezing) and while the little battery will eventually warm up while cranking enough to start the car, it takes a long time and I've now just given up and started taking the battery inside at night to put on the trickle charger.

Good thing that's pretty easy to do... =)

No sense in wearing out my starter...

_________________
Quote:
No one expects the Spanish Inquisition!

Spanish Inquisition Racing chip burning service--build yourself a custom chip!
http://www.teamswift.net/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=57216


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Racing battery
PostPosted: Wed Apr 23, 2014 11:38 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Dec 05, 2010 5:56 pm
Posts: 1023
Location: Wahiawa, HI
Aaaand it's dead :cry:

I guess I need to rule out a major parasitic draw from my car, but I don't believe that's the problem--it's just not holding a charge overnight anymore. Which sucks, as I have an event this weekend, though maybe it will work well enough if I take it out of the car and charge it up before hand.

Oh well. A year and a half is not great--could be worse, for what it is, but not great.

I like the way I've fabbed up my tray and connections for this size batter and quick-connect though, so I'm not sure what I get next...

_________________
Quote:
No one expects the Spanish Inquisition!

Spanish Inquisition Racing chip burning service--build yourself a custom chip!
http://www.teamswift.net/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=57216


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Racing battery
PostPosted: Wed Apr 23, 2014 6:22 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Dec 05, 2010 5:56 pm
Posts: 1023
Location: Wahiawa, HI
OK, no it's really dead :cry:

Says it has a full charge but won't turn over the car. I'll follow up with whatever's next--probably also LiFePo4, but maybe a different source and I'll try to take better care of it.

_________________
Quote:
No one expects the Spanish Inquisition!

Spanish Inquisition Racing chip burning service--build yourself a custom chip!
http://www.teamswift.net/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=57216


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Racing battery
PostPosted: Wed May 07, 2014 2:35 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Dec 05, 2010 5:56 pm
Posts: 1023
Location: Wahiawa, HI
Well, I needed a new battery, but couldn't bear to go back to a heavy conventional style.

I ended up getting one from Doug at MOTY design: http://www.motydesign.com/product.php?batteries=12-cell-oem-case

Doug threw in the quick disconnect for free and the shipping is free too. It's exactly the same battery as I had before, but this time it's in a plastic case, which I think will help it to live longer, and also has a port for balance charging, which I've learned is necessary if the battery ever falls below threshold and has to be charged.

Here it is in the car:

Image

The case allows for a slightly cleaner installation.

I'll be making sure this one is disconnected every time the car sits overnight or longer.

_________________
Quote:
No one expects the Spanish Inquisition!

Spanish Inquisition Racing chip burning service--build yourself a custom chip!
http://www.teamswift.net/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=57216


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Racing battery
PostPosted: Thu May 08, 2014 12:57 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Feb 21, 2006 10:47 pm
Posts: 1541
Location: burlington,ontario
Came on here to find this thread so thanks teeth for replying to this thread, made my life a bit easier.

Have been looking into a smaller and lighter battery to replace the optima yellow top I have been running in a few cars for about 6years now. Went and priced out a smaller version of the yellow top locally and it was over 300$ and still around 20lbs so it was quickly cut from the list of possibilities.

Has anyone ran the A123 cell batteries with a small amp and sub woofer in the car?
I work out of my car and do a lot of start the car drive 100feet then it sits for an hour some times with the radio on, I have a small solar panel in the car that I plug into the cig lighter most of the time that the radio is on.

The braille battery would probably be my best option after some reserch I found they are rebranded Deka batteries now I just need to find a supplier locally.

_________________
1992 geo metro the perpetual project car
1986 suzuki samurai LWB aka beth
1994 suzuki sidekick 4 door


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Racing battery
PostPosted: Thu May 08, 2014 8:24 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Dec 05, 2010 5:56 pm
Posts: 1023
Location: Wahiawa, HI
Well, I have no stereo at all, so I'm no help.

I also have an underdrive pulley, though.

The main thing is to be religious about using the quick disconnect--I don't know whether 6.9 Ah would run your stereo for an hour and still start your car or not. It's possible that it would be no problem, but I suspect you are on the right track with an AGM-type battery as a safer bet.

_________________
Quote:
No one expects the Spanish Inquisition!

Spanish Inquisition Racing chip burning service--build yourself a custom chip!
http://www.teamswift.net/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=57216


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Racing battery
PostPosted: Thu May 08, 2014 4:41 pm 
Offline
Suzuki Elder
User avatar

Joined: Mon Dec 01, 2003 12:47 pm
Posts: 11663
Location: columbus, ohio
the under drive pulley won't be any problem at all. as a matter of fact if you spend a lot of time at higher engine rpms it will work better with a lithium ion type battery.

the alternator output is dependent on rotor speed and the pulley on the alternator is pretty small compared to the accessory pulley on the crankshaft. if the engine is running 1000 rpm, the alternator rotor speed is more like 4000 rpm with a 5" stock crank pulley. dropping to an aluminum 4" pulley drops the alternator rotor speed at idle to something more like 3000 rpm, still more than enough to produce a healthy charge current.

when the engine is above 4500-5000 rpm, the alternator is already pretty much shut down so as to not overcharge a lead acid battery. lithium batteries don't like being overcharged, either, and they are a little more bitchy about charge voltage anyway. the under drive pulley is probably helping more than you realize. :wink:

_________________
1991 Blue Geo Metro Convertible highly modified 1.0L Turbo3 5 spd. - 1991 Red Geo Metro Convertible customized with a Twincam 5 spd.

My Turbo3 Project
My Cardomain Page -Ol' Blue
My YouTube Channel
My Photo Gallery
SAAB Sonett II


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Racing battery
PostPosted: Fri May 09, 2014 3:56 am 
Offline
Senior Member
User avatar

Joined: Thu Feb 12, 2004 11:30 pm
Posts: 1706
Location: Rivendell
Seriously considering the following as my next battery of choice.
http://www.ultrabatt.com/ love the stackability

_________________
Understeer is when you hit the wall with the front of the car and oversteer is when you hit the wall with the rear of the car.HP is how fast you hit the wall, torque is how much you push the wall out.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Racing battery
PostPosted: Fri May 09, 2014 5:02 am 
Offline
Teamswift Racer
User avatar

Joined: Fri Apr 02, 2004 5:56 am
Posts: 2322
Location: Christchurch NZ, quake capital
Thats pretty cool, the main thing that improves battery life for automotive applications is the balance charging or cell equalization as Teeth mentioned, only needs to be charged over night every couple of months of use.

Shorai have good batteries and balance charger, I will be changing over to these later this year.


http://shoraipower.com/chargers-c43
http://shoraipower.com/lfx12a1-bs12-p58


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Racing battery
PostPosted: Mon Jun 30, 2014 12:58 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Feb 21, 2006 10:47 pm
Posts: 1541
Location: burlington,ontario
Well I ended up picking up a Ballistic EVO2 battery for my car. Will keep you guys updated on how it goes.

I ended up buying another car for a daily driver so I dont need to worry about the amp and the short trips anymore.

Image

_________________
1992 geo metro the perpetual project car
1986 suzuki samurai LWB aka beth
1994 suzuki sidekick 4 door


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Racing battery
PostPosted: Thu Oct 27, 2016 8:07 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Dec 05, 2010 5:56 pm
Posts: 1023
Location: Wahiawa, HI
I thought I'd check in with the long term report:

The Moty Designs battery is now 2.5 years old, and I've had two "episodes" with it, both cases probably due to failing to balance charge it often enough. The first happened after my sister left the keys in the car for a couple hours at the autocross--nothing on in the car, key definitely off, but failed to crank and interior lights dimming. Jump started without catching on fire, then balance charged at home. That was about a year ago, and I've balanced it at least twice since then, but not recently (maybe 6 months?). The wife was driving last and definitely turned everything off, but didn't pull the quick disconnect. I haven't been bothering either because the battery has been trouble free for so long.

So, this morning I turn the key and nothing. The balance charger wouldn't charge it either for being undervoltage, but in reality it wasn't that bad, though one cell was below 2 volts. I had to trickle charge at 0.1 amps in the Nimh mode (so it would bypass the LiFe low voltage safety) for a few minutes before it would balance charge properly in LiFe mode.

I did put the battery in the middle of a concrete pad while getting it to minimum voltage, but it never even got warm.

I plan to put the day I balance charge it on the calendar bimonthly and hope the regular maintenance keeps it alive a bit longer.

_________________
Quote:
No one expects the Spanish Inquisition!

Spanish Inquisition Racing chip burning service--build yourself a custom chip!
http://www.teamswift.net/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=57216


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 96 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4

All times are UTC - 5 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 3 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group