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Underbody braces, turbos and more!

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PostPosted: Sun Jul 17, 2011 9:17 am 
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Joined: Wed Jan 07, 2004 10:52 pm
Posts: 132
Location: Qc Canada
some gear ratios ...
------ gt ---- jdm ---- 1.6 ---- sx407-sx408 --- esteem1.8 --- aerio2.3 - swift sport 07+
1-----3.416 - 3.416 - 3.250 - 3.545---" -------- 3.545 ------- 3.545 -----3.250
2-----1.894 - 1.894 - 1.772 - 1.904---" -------- 1.904 ------- 1.904 ------1.904
3-----1.280 - 1.375 - 1.233 - 1.310---" -------- 1.310 ------- 1.23 ------ 1.407
4-----0.914 - 1.030 - 0.911 - 0.969---"--------- 0.969 ------- 0.91 ----- 1.064
5-----0.757 - 0.870 - 0.769 - 0.815 - 0.73 ----- 0.815 ------- 0.73 ----- .885
final--4.105 - 4.105 - 3.722 - 4.41 --- 4.41 ------ 3.79 ------- 3.74 ----- 4.388

inputshaft esteem 1.8
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input shaft sx4
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input shaft swift 1.6
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input shaft sx4 Vs esteem 1.8(in my hand)
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listing is for aerio 2.0l 2002-2004 and it bolts on the swift's 1.6 flywheel, disc spline 7/8 20, 200 mm diameter (1.3 is 190mm)
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don't know if this will support all the torque in 1st gear at the drag strip...
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1.6 pedals (to swap the hydraulic clutch)
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2000 cable clutch
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think,cut,drill,swear
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bolt of 1.6 pedals is not long enough to install the 1.6 pedal on the 2000 rack
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and cable shifter requires grinding brackets in the car, under the console, the console itself must be cut and glued to provide clearance for the shifter assembly (no photo yet)

an old link from a random kia (found in the garbage at work), 9.91mm shaft on it
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ressucited as a bolt
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some shims
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2000 pedal is straight and 1.6 swift is curved (must bend the 1.6 pedal straight to provide clearance between brake and clutch pedal)
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some ugly welding to re-install switches and stoppers
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a flywheel from australia for 1.6 fwd conversion (from dmwdave)
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must drill and make a hole for shifter cables
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_________________
swift 2000
megasquirt efi
rx7 460cc injectors
td05h-16g @ 18 psi
SRP forged civic piston
suprf1y's 200-335i 210-240e camshaft
1.6 gearbox with swift sport 2007 gear ratios
cusco 1way LSD


Last edited by bostssgt on Sun Feb 23, 2014 9:49 am, edited 3 times in total.

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PostPosted: Mon Jul 18, 2011 7:14 pm 
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Location: Qc Canada
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_________________
swift 2000
megasquirt efi
rx7 460cc injectors
td05h-16g @ 18 psi
SRP forged civic piston
suprf1y's 200-335i 210-240e camshaft
1.6 gearbox with swift sport 2007 gear ratios
cusco 1way LSD


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 19, 2011 10:20 pm 
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Joined: Wed Jan 07, 2004 10:52 pm
Posts: 132
Location: Qc Canada
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_________________
swift 2000
megasquirt efi
rx7 460cc injectors
td05h-16g @ 18 psi
SRP forged civic piston
suprf1y's 200-335i 210-240e camshaft
1.6 gearbox with swift sport 2007 gear ratios
cusco 1way LSD


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PostPosted: Thu Jul 21, 2011 7:46 am 
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Joined: Wed Jan 07, 2004 10:52 pm
Posts: 132
Location: Qc Canada
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drill 27/64 and make m12X1.25 and pu studs
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drill a taper in the back and weld the stud
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_________________
swift 2000
megasquirt efi
rx7 460cc injectors
td05h-16g @ 18 psi
SRP forged civic piston
suprf1y's 200-335i 210-240e camshaft
1.6 gearbox with swift sport 2007 gear ratios
cusco 1way LSD


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 03, 2011 6:02 pm 
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Joined: Wed Jan 07, 2004 10:52 pm
Posts: 132
Location: Qc Canada
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shimmm
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right cable lowered 3/8
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DONE!

_________________
swift 2000
megasquirt efi
rx7 460cc injectors
td05h-16g @ 18 psi
SRP forged civic piston
suprf1y's 200-335i 210-240e camshaft
1.6 gearbox with swift sport 2007 gear ratios
cusco 1way LSD


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 03, 2011 8:06 pm 
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Joined: Mon Nov 23, 2009 12:37 am
Posts: 1059
Location: Vancouver, Best Cannabis
good build. so what's the major advantage of this set up ?

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Silver 2000 Firefly 4DR; 16V SOHC, 3 to 5 speed swap, install PS and AC, remote and auto start, PL, PW, kill and start switch, Valentine 1, behind-bumper CAI, 55MM TB with coolant-bypass, polyurethane-fill engine/shifter mounts, modified to short shifter, upgraded electrical system, CS130 alternator, 90/160W headlights + relay mod, ceramic H4 plug/harness
To do: finish stereo, 4000K H4 HIDs, short block replacement
'sponsored' by Captain Crunch, Lordco, Felpro, Permatex, Royal Purple


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 04, 2011 5:49 am 
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Location: Qc Canada
strenght, check my pictures at the end of the "transmission carnage" thread :lol:

the gear ratios in this box are long, i have ordered a set of swift sport gears, with a 4.4 final drive, this is near a bolt-on swap in these box, only have to machine a groove for a snap ring on the swift sport shaft,
the 3.250 1st and 1.904 second gear with 4.4 final ratio reduce the gap between the 1st and 2nd gear, best combo with stock suzuki parts,

with this swap i will do better 1/4!! (without breaking everything :mrgreen: )

_________________
swift 2000
megasquirt efi
rx7 460cc injectors
td05h-16g @ 18 psi
SRP forged civic piston
suprf1y's 200-335i 210-240e camshaft
1.6 gearbox with swift sport 2007 gear ratios
cusco 1way LSD


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PostPosted: Fri Aug 05, 2011 5:32 pm 
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Joined: Mon Nov 23, 2009 12:37 am
Posts: 1059
Location: Vancouver, Best Cannabis
OH, i see, because your engine output power is more than the stock transmission can handle safely !
because of your turbo setup. does one have to worry about the stock transmission failing only if they have a turbo or not ?

_________________
Silver 2000 Firefly 4DR; 16V SOHC, 3 to 5 speed swap, install PS and AC, remote and auto start, PL, PW, kill and start switch, Valentine 1, behind-bumper CAI, 55MM TB with coolant-bypass, polyurethane-fill engine/shifter mounts, modified to short shifter, upgraded electrical system, CS130 alternator, 90/160W headlights + relay mod, ceramic H4 plug/harness
To do: finish stereo, 4000K H4 HIDs, short block replacement
'sponsored' by Captain Crunch, Lordco, Felpro, Permatex, Royal Purple


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PostPosted: Fri Aug 05, 2011 6:03 pm 
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bostssgt wrote:
strenght, check my pictures at the end of the "transmission carnage" thread :lol:

the gear ratios in this box are long, i have ordered a set of swift sport gears, with a 4.4 final drive, this is near a bolt-on swap in these box, only have to machine a groove for a snap ring on the swift sport shaft,
the 3.250 1st and 1.904 second gear with 4.4 final ratio reduce the gap between the 1st and 2nd gear, best combo with stock suzuki parts,

with this swap i will do better 1/4!! (without breaking everything :mrgreen: )


You are one of the few that understands how gearing works. Most people think they can drop down to a 3.79 once they go turbo. Nothing could be further from the truth. It will make everything except cruise RPM worse.

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PostPosted: Fri Aug 05, 2011 7:05 pm 
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Location: Alberta, Canada
This is a great thread, thanks a lot for the excellent write up. I have the parts to do this someday, and this will really help a lot!
I understand gear ratios and such fairly well, but lack experience with turbos. I'm curious to hear that the 3.79's will not work well with a turbo car? I was thinking that the longer gears would give the engine more time in each gear to 'stretch its legs' so to speak, and the added torque would counteract the shorter ratio.
So, that said, with my gearing options of 4.39, 4.10, 3.79, 3.52, I should go with 4.39 when I finally get my turbo kit onto a gti? Seems I have been assuming here, and not leaning the right direction. I dont think I will break trannies yet, its only going to be low boost for a while anyways, so I will likely start with the weaker trannies for now.

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1995 Swift w/16V 4.39s, 3tech cam, Esteem t-body, Header, needs more.
1995 Gt Mustang "Boss Shinoda" package.
1999 F150 4x4 Supercharged
1967 Mustang 428 auto, never ending expensive project
1993 Civic si h22a, fell in my lap, couldn't resist!


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PostPosted: Fri Aug 05, 2011 8:23 pm 
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4.10 or 4.39.
The 3.79 will cause even worse wheel spin, and the loss of mechanical advantage will only make it that much harder on the transmission, and shorten it's lifespan.

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 16, 2011 8:54 pm 
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Joined: Wed Jan 07, 2004 10:52 pm
Posts: 132
Location: Qc Canada
Cusco LSD for suzuki swift sport ZC31S 2007 M16A
LSD part number# LSD 617 H from http://www.rhdjapan.com

Image

Image

Image

_________________
swift 2000
megasquirt efi
rx7 460cc injectors
td05h-16g @ 18 psi
SRP forged civic piston
suprf1y's 200-335i 210-240e camshaft
1.6 gearbox with swift sport 2007 gear ratios
cusco 1way LSD


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 16, 2011 9:18 pm 
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Joined: Wed Jan 07, 2004 10:52 pm
Posts: 132
Location: Qc Canada
codyb76 wrote:
This is a great thread, thanks a lot for the excellent write up. I have the parts to do this someday, and this will really help a lot!
I understand gear ratios and such fairly well, but lack experience with turbos. I'm curious to hear that the 3.79's will not work well with a turbo car? I was thinking that the longer gears would give the engine more time in each gear to 'stretch its legs' so to speak, and the added torque would counteract the shorter ratio.
So, that said, with my gearing options of 4.39, 4.10, 3.79, 3.52, I should go with 4.39 when I finally get my turbo kit onto a gti? Seems I have been assuming here, and not leaning the right direction. I dont think I will break trannies yet, its only going to be low boost for a while anyways, so I will likely start with the weaker trannies for now.


what you need is to match the gearing with the powerband , and make choice between acceleration ,speed, mpg.

i made my gearing class 101 back in the days on gran turismo 2 :lol:

_________________
swift 2000
megasquirt efi
rx7 460cc injectors
td05h-16g @ 18 psi
SRP forged civic piston
suprf1y's 200-335i 210-240e camshaft
1.6 gearbox with swift sport 2007 gear ratios
cusco 1way LSD


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 18, 2011 8:36 am 
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Location: Budapest, Hungary - Europe
Can't wait to see pictures of the new transmission! :)

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PostPosted: Mon Aug 22, 2011 5:50 pm 
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with swift sport 4.388 crown bolted
Image
1way
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_________________
swift 2000
megasquirt efi
rx7 460cc injectors
td05h-16g @ 18 psi
SRP forged civic piston
suprf1y's 200-335i 210-240e camshaft
1.6 gearbox with swift sport 2007 gear ratios
cusco 1way LSD


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PostPosted: Tue May 08, 2012 1:23 am 
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Location: Cincinnati, Ohio
bostssgt wrote:
i have ordered a set of swift sport gears, with a 4.4 final drive


I don't mean to sound like an idiot, but if you bought new gears & final drive, why did you by them for the (I think) J18 trans and not just put these parts in the stock case that came with the car? From what I can tell, the gears you bought are the same ones I would buy for my '93 Swift GT? Please pardon my ignorance as I attempt to understand upgrading the stock trans to something more bullet proof?

I have to say, that looks like a @#$% load of work to do for a transmission upgrade. What is the total cost of all this - not including your valuable labor? And what is the advantage to putting in the different trans as opposed to upgrading the weak internals on the stock box? Especially considering you bought new gears and an LSD?

Thanks, Shimaze

_________________
1993 Suzuki Swift GT DOHC / 5-speed
1996 GEO Metro 1.0 3 cyl. / 5-speed
Other cars & motorcycle:
  • 2001 S10 Xtreme
  • 1996 Impala SS
  • 1994 Camaro Z/28
  • 1988 Honda NX650
  • 1980 Honda PA50
Shimaze's cars


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PostPosted: Tue May 08, 2012 2:54 am 
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Location: Chur chur the 'Shaky State' NZ
Here are the ratio's for the M 16 swift sport, available world wide except North America :roll:

(1) 3.250
(2) 1.904
(3) 1.407
(4) 1.064
(5) 0.885
Final: 4.388

The J series box has a 3.5 1st and the same 1.904 2nd, the swift sedan cable shift box has 3.25 1st and 1.772 2nd, whereas the swift sport box (M16) has the best of both gearboxes and is an off the shelf gearset.
The close gearing and 4.4 diff is actually more suited to a normally aspirated setup rather than turbo but if you are making huge hp in a turbo setup your power band will be much narrower than a low boost setup.

Reminds me of the WRC escorts from the 90's, it ran a 7 speed gearbox until they bought in 36mm restrictors forcing the engineers to aim for high torque instead of high hp, after that they went back down to 6 speeds and when they bought in 34mm restrictors some manufacturers even changed back down to 5 wider spaced gears, wide power bands don't need close gearing.

Shimaze these gearboxes, swift sedan g16 cable, AWD mk2/3 swift, J series and M series are the 'large' frame gearboxes, they have a distance of 70mm between the input and counter shafts.

The G10/G13b fwd, Esteem G16 rod change gearboxes are 'small' framed gearboxes, 60mm between the input and counter shafts, 10mm might not sound like much but it's a huge difference in terms of what size bearings and teeth can be used in that space.

Shimaze for the record, the small framed boxes are fine unless it is worn, abused or turbo'ed, the biggest issue is the low speed synchro hub having to match the wide gap between 1st and 2nd gear and the wear on the diff pin.
If you rebuild your box properly with good bearings and make sure there is minimal freeplay between your spider gears it should be fine, it is a little tiring hearing people whinge about 'glass gearboxes' when they swap in a 2nd hand box with 170k on it, thrash it and then it breaks :roll:

In 8 years of racing both a mk1 and mk3 I have never had a gearbox issue and I can assure you both cars cop plenty of abuse.

bostssgt nice job, just for the record some swift sedans had cable clutches so there is a direct fit option available for the clutch but hydraulic is better anyway.

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PostPosted: Tue May 08, 2012 6:03 am 
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Posts: 132
Location: Qc Canada
shimaze wrote:
bostssgt wrote:
i have ordered a set of swift sport gears, with a 4.4 final drive


I don't mean to sound like an idiot, but if you bought new gears & final drive, why did you by them for the (I think) J18 trans and not just put these parts in the stock case that came with the car?
because the small box (g13) can't take all my torque in 3rd gear,check my post in the transmission carnage.... this box was upgraded to overseas GTI gearing, never had another issue with these box... just fix it when it grind on the 2nd or when bearing noise appears.... if you are under 140lbs/ft of torque ( 200 hp) stick with the g13 box

I have to say, that looks like a @#$% load of work to do for a transmission upgrade. What is the total cost of all this - not including your valuable labor? And what is the advantage to putting in the different trans as opposed to upgrading the weak internals on the stock box? Especially considering you bought new gears and an LSD?
paid 1k for the gears, 1.3k for the limited slip, 300$ for a donor swift sedan1.6, 800$ for the flywheel (can use the stock one but too heavy for me) 400$ for a clutch (can use the stock one but will not hold the torque) my friend done the case(welding,milling,dowel pin) in exchange of a headgasket job on his tacoma,

Thanks, Shimaze


i don't have time to spend on fix/replace transmission every time i break it
i NEED this box to put the power on the ground

_________________
swift 2000
megasquirt efi
rx7 460cc injectors
td05h-16g @ 18 psi
SRP forged civic piston
suprf1y's 200-335i 210-240e camshaft
1.6 gearbox with swift sport 2007 gear ratios
cusco 1way LSD


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PostPosted: Tue May 08, 2012 6:06 am 
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Posts: 132
Location: Qc Canada
Dattman wrote:
........bostssgt nice job, just for the record some swift sedans had cable clutches so there is a direct fit option available for the clutch but hydraulic is better anyway.


thank you, i think it's a bit ghetto setup except for the parts :lol:

_________________
swift 2000
megasquirt efi
rx7 460cc injectors
td05h-16g @ 18 psi
SRP forged civic piston
suprf1y's 200-335i 210-240e camshaft
1.6 gearbox with swift sport 2007 gear ratios
cusco 1way LSD


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PostPosted: Tue May 08, 2012 5:12 pm 
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Location: Vancouver, WA
so this is using the cable/hydraulic swift 1.6 trans (the one we didnt get south of the border) correct?


in another thread it was mentioned the j18 (esteem) and g16 share bellhousing bolt patterns any chance you can confirm this?

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98 swift 1.6 16v swap
03 cobra bolt ons
97 3000gt vr4 e85, high comp, bolt ons
too many others to list


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PostPosted: Tue May 08, 2012 7:32 pm 
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g16 swift, and j18 esteem/baleno and aerio j20 j23 boxes are sharing same bolt pattern
i have one j18 and one j20 box for parts and the housings are the same

_________________
swift 2000
megasquirt efi
rx7 460cc injectors
td05h-16g @ 18 psi
SRP forged civic piston
suprf1y's 200-335i 210-240e camshaft
1.6 gearbox with swift sport 2007 gear ratios
cusco 1way LSD


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PostPosted: Tue May 08, 2012 10:09 pm 
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Location: Lithuania
bostssgt wrote:
g16 swift, and j18 esteem/baleno and aerio j20 j23 boxes are sharing same bolt pattern
i have one j18 and one j20 box for parts and the housings are the same


What about diff and axles?

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I ride a Honda, but I drive a Suzuki.

99 Honda CB600F Hornet
90 Suzuki Swift 1.6 GLX 4WD


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PostPosted: Wed May 09, 2012 6:01 am 
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Posts: 132
Location: Qc Canada
bostssgt wrote:
Cusco LSD for suzuki swift sport ZC31S 2007 M16A
LSD part number# LSD 617 H from http://www.rhdjapan.com

[]http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c31/bostssgt/DSC04694-1.jpg[/img]

[]http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c31/bostssgt/DSC04695.jpg[/img]

[]http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c31/bostssgt/DSC04696.jpg[/img]


axle are from the swift glx 1.6


you need a diff with a place to put you plastic gear for the speedo, some car had a trigger for an electronic sensor some don't, esteem and swift plastic wheel, aerio 2.0l have cast metal wheel... and for the 2.3 i dont know, buy one and tell me!!! :lol: all off them fit the swift 1.6 axles inner splines

_________________
swift 2000
megasquirt efi
rx7 460cc injectors
td05h-16g @ 18 psi
SRP forged civic piston
suprf1y's 200-335i 210-240e camshaft
1.6 gearbox with swift sport 2007 gear ratios
cusco 1way LSD


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PostPosted: Wed May 09, 2012 2:27 pm 
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Posts: 875
Location: Vancouver, WA
bostssgt wrote:
g16 swift, and j18 esteem/baleno and aerio j20 j23 boxes are sharing same bolt pattern
i have one j18 and one j20 box for parts and the housings are the same



thanks. now i have another option when i blow up this esteem 1.6 trans. i would love to do the swift cable shift trans but theyre made of unobtanium down here.

just gotta figure out the rest of it....(clutch, axles, etc)

_________________
98 swift 1.6 16v swap
03 cobra bolt ons
97 3000gt vr4 e85, high comp, bolt ons
too many others to list


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PostPosted: Wed May 09, 2012 3:17 pm 
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Well now I'm certainly keeping hold of my g16 tranny, it's cable shift and 4wd :mrgreen:
So the swift 1.6 transmission is stronger than the baleno/esteem 1.6, right? What about the baleno/esteem 1.6 4wd box? I could get a hold if it easier than a j18/j20.

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I ride a Honda, but I drive a Suzuki.

99 Honda CB600F Hornet
90 Suzuki Swift 1.6 GLX 4WD


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