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PostPosted: Thu Oct 13, 2011 10:01 pm 
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Location: Arkansas
I just bought a 1987 Sprint to replace my 1988 sprint which is basically gone.
The new 87 Sprint is clean, completely factory, runs fine, but idles at 3500rpm.
The guy I bought it from said his mechanic son-in-law thought that it was a sensor.
I don't know.
I ran the idle screw all the way in and out. I could get it to idle higher but not any lower than 3500.
I can hold the flaps shut and manually hold one of the one of the controls on the side and get it down to about 1300, but it goes back up.

The 3,500 rpm idle is sorta fixed. We are down to 2,500 when cold and almost normal when warm but dies now when warm. See below for latest.


Thanks for any advise in advance.


Last edited by jrockflimflam on Mon Oct 24, 2011 9:16 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 13, 2011 10:40 pm 
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Location: Palm Springs: Too hot from June to Oct.!
Hi jrockflimflam.
You post some pictures of your ride, including the engine compartment, and I'll be happy to go over step by step some of the ways to get that idle down.
Don't forget the under hood sticker.
Best regards...jrockflimflam...

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Once you get the cars dialed-in (compression, leaks, bearings, alignment, brakes) swap in new rubber and glass, you've got something which should last for years!


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 13, 2011 11:53 pm 
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Location: Palmdale, Ca
Edit: Sorry I thought I saw Sprint Turbo in the title.

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1987 Chevrolet Sprint Turbo under construction


Last edited by 1987TurboSprint on Fri Oct 14, 2011 8:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 14, 2011 8:12 pm 
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Location: Arkansas
Thanks for the replies. Didn't get pictures to day but I did turn the "Actuator - Idle Up" Item #2 as described in the diagram I found on http://www.teamswift.net/viewtopic.php?f=15&t=38699 clockwise until it stopped.
This did bring the idle down to 1650 while engine was fully warmed up.
After the engine was cold while at work, I started it and it went up to 2,500.
A few stop lights later after engine was warmed up it went back to 1,650.

Not fixed yet but maybe this will give a clue as to what is going on.
Tomorrow I will clean motor, change oil, change air filter, and try to get pics of engine with breather off.

It also has a leaky valve cover gasket, which I will be changing soon.


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 15, 2011 6:19 pm 
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Location: Arkansas
Image
Picture of the carb. I think its a Hitachi but I don't know.

Image
The Engine Family Identification is HSK 1.0V 2FFC6

Image
Hose labeled A will be changed tomorrow.
After making a few adjustments I described in the last post it now only idles when it is cold.
After it warms up it idles around 1200-1600, but will randomly bottom out to ZERO and bounce back and forth
between 100 or barely staying going to 1000, over and over.
If you give it a little gas to around 1500 and hold it there for few second and let off it will continue to stay at 1200-1600 for a few minutes
and then bottom out again.
If I hold carb levers B & C in the picture on the left side of the carb down, or open, it will stay around 1200-1600 and not bottom out.

I am currently looking at another post for factory settings.
I am trying to figure out how many different places this carb has to adjust and how to get them all back to factory.
I have not idea what all has been adjusted and how on, by the previous owners. :roll:


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 15, 2011 10:47 pm 
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Location: Emerald city Washington
I also had a high idle problem on a sprint isolated it found the top to the charcol canister was broken leaking vacume


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 16, 2011 1:15 am 
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Location: Palm Springs: Too hot from June to Oct.!
OK
You've got my attention.
You did your part, now I'll chime in.

First, let's talk about the three vacuum lines. They are on the back of the carb.
The line going between the vacuum advance on the distributor and the three ports on the back of the carb? That should plug in at the top.
Follow your diagram; the bottom nipple is for the line which goes to the transducer (snaps into air cleaner housing).
The middle nipple goes to the (BVSV) vacuum switching valve. Clear as mud?

Next, take a look at the manual if you have time. I do not take credit for this, but I did put it in order for you:
http://s145.photobucket.com/albums/r211 ... %20Manual/
The manual will describe how to test your microswitches. Personally, I wouldn't worrry about them at this point.

You are going to replace hose A which is a tube which is open from the charcoal canister and won't affect the idle, but will cut down on any fumes you might smell under the hood.
It goes to the 'bowl vent solenoid'.

As far as plain adjusting, you will adjust the idle when it is cold, adjust the idle when it is warm, and then adjust the 'Idle Up Actuator' to compensate for an electric load when the car is warm.
Of course, the O2 sensor should be replaced as it tells the ECM that it will now control the MCS and the mixture.
Here is how to adjust the idle.
Image
Roman Numeral 2 - adjust first; cold idle
Roman Numeral 5 - adjust second; warm idle (wax thermoelement will no longer hold idle up high when warm coolant is circulating through it.)
Roman Numeral 3- adjust last, once the other two are correct. It shows the gap but you will adjust by turning the screw inside the Idle Up Actuator.
Hope I've got the sequence right.
Let me know if I made a mistake.

Almost forgot.
If your A/C is working, it has a separate idle up actuator.
It is Roman Numeral 4 and the one you adjust after the first three.
Roman Numeral 1? Bottom part of 'thermowax element'. They are pretty bullet proof.
You've got to get that adjusted pronto when you first fire up a cold MK1.
Image
The carb in your picture is a B2 and in seemingly pristine condition. If so, that MCS is well overdue.
It is the correct carb for a 5 speed with A/C, as you appear to have, although you did NOT provide more wide angle pictures.
(see, there's a reason I asked for pictures...)

When most people rebuild the carbs, the B2 gets washed off unfortunately. Do us all a favor.
If you DO clean that carburetor, skip the top of the thermowax element. Leave those model numbers intact. And don't immerse it in some stupid old carb cleaner. Just shoot a gentle spray of plain old Simple Green on it, give it a LIGHT once over with an old toothbrush, and rinse with tap water. Your engine will thank you for it.

Other model carburetors include:
B1
B3
B4
C9 and
D0
depending on MK1 model, and accessories, so you will understand that asking for a rebuilt carburetor without supplying the model number or application is like asking Moderator Suprf1y to grind you a cam without specifying the lift and duration or year make and model. There are variations even within years. It goes from the sublime to the ridiculous if you ask for a 'friend', and can't supply a single picture. But I digress.

At the end of the day, if you cannot adjust the cold and warm idles within a few minutes and it just 'dies' when it drops below a certain rpm, then you have to suspect the 24 year old MCS. Do a visual inspection of the two MCS wires and see if they have been soldered.

Before you throw in the towel and decide it needs a rebuild, here is the FIRST place to start.
You only need a keen eye:
On the passenger side, there is a sight glass.
Image
You should be able to see the gasoline/air level at the middle of the sight glass.
Unlike other carburetors, this is not adjustable without removing the top.
So the obvious question is: Can you see the level in the sight glass?
You cannot adjust the idles...warm, cold, idle up, A/C idle up until that fuel level is correct.
Hope this helps. I am no expert, but there are a few members here who can steer you right.
Image
...and that, Mr. jrockflimflam is how the cow ate the cabbage.

Let us know what happens, and make sure to supplement your information with some pictures and/or video if you are serious about getting more 'in depth' help. No one here has a monopoly on information...that's why Teamswift was created! :wink: :wink: :wink:

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DIY Broken Bolt Removal: viewtopic.php?f=22&t=41042
DIY Clutch Adjustment: viewtopic.php?f=9&t=48281
DIY Wheel Bearings: viewtopic.php?f=2&t=29003
DIY Shocks: viewtopic.php?f=10&t=45483
DIY Wheel Align: viewtopic.php?f=2&t=42479
Once you get the cars dialed-in (compression, leaks, bearings, alignment, brakes) swap in new rubber and glass, you've got something which should last for years!


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 16, 2011 8:56 pm 
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Another item that might could cause a higher than avg idle is a throttle cable too tight, especailly if maybe the idle screw doesnt seem to have much downward effect....by the looks of your pics, it appears that maybe the previous owner wasnt much in preventative maint either...that being said, how is one to know that the coolant system is not crusted up to no end in places. The wax module on the carb could be gunked up and never allowing the wax part to heat up enough to drop it out of warm up mode. .as youve just bought it, it woudl be hard to say....As Phil states, If your 02 sensor is bad, along with its feedback to the ecm and MCS, that also might cause all sorts of off or odd idling. That part about "but will randomly bottom out to ZERO and bounce back and forth" sorta sounds like that. I'd follow the given advice for checking all hoses for proper connection and of course being in good shape and not rotten like your hose "a". Then do all the sequential adjustments, cold idle, warm idle, dwell/mixture, idle up. But also make sure the timing is proper and that your getting good fire. If after all of that is still wont idle down I strongly consider removing the carb and doing a proper rebuild. That is if you want it to be right and persoanlly know its condtion and that it IS right. Lots of good info on the carbs here.

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Mike
Valley Grande, AL
1986 Sprint plus

Do you maintain a personal fleet like I do?
Why do we do it?
Because it's what we enjoy and because we CAN.
2011 camaro, 2005 Vibe, 2004 camry, 06 Expedition, 87 porsche 911, 86 Sprint plus, 73 gmc 4x4, 69 camaro, 99 Gl1500 Goldwing, 12 Kawasaki klr650, 2012 Kubota L3200, and we wont even go into the small stuff.


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 20, 2011 1:53 am 
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Location: Palm Springs: Too hot from June to Oct.!
You were here 3 hours ago, but still no feedback, so I guess we were able to help you with your high idle problem.
Score:
Teamswift - 1
Manners - :roll: (Jury is still out in Arkansas)

Here's a couple quick questions for you...
In this picture,
Image
are you using one or two gaskets on the carburetor throat?
Also, what kind of clamps are you using to hold the hose to the thermowax element?

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DIY Broken Bolt Removal: viewtopic.php?f=22&t=41042
DIY Clutch Adjustment: viewtopic.php?f=9&t=48281
DIY Wheel Bearings: viewtopic.php?f=2&t=29003
DIY Shocks: viewtopic.php?f=10&t=45483
DIY Wheel Align: viewtopic.php?f=2&t=42479
Once you get the cars dialed-in (compression, leaks, bearings, alignment, brakes) swap in new rubber and glass, you've got something which should last for years!


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 20, 2011 6:00 pm 
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Location: Arkansas
Hi,
Thanks to everyone for the help.
Phil N Ed, Yes I did drop by the other night but I was researching other threads mostly.
My bad for not thanking everyone already. :D
As far as manners in Arkansas, I ain't found none yet. I mean we did produce Bill and Hillary :mrgreen:
I have cleared out a spot in my garage (where I have lights) for the sprint so I can better go over all the instructions the great folks here on teamswift have given.
It's hard for me to find enough day light to really get in to diagnosis before I have to put everything back together, as I work sun up to sun down now that winter is getting close. :cry:
I can up date that thanks to the advise above it doesn't idle at 3,500 anymore.

I will be back later to give a more detailed, here is what I have checked, what I have found, and how the car is responding.

=)


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 23, 2012 4:02 pm 
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Location: Jamaica
the info here is great. Just wish it was on the Aisan carbs we get here in Jamaice. They are two barrel but different fron the one in the exploded pics in carb threads


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 23, 2013 2:09 pm 
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Location: western washington
Hi, I am looking for the function of a green plastic capped vacuum switch(?)

screwed into the intake manifold called 'gas filter' on vacuum diagram,

and pictured in the '86 sprint smog check list'. the picture is above captioned "Next thing I discovered was the top port on the vacuum manifold was plugged up solid."

I am gluing brass ferules on to replace the plastic nipples I broke off. Is this an available part? What is it's name. Can I use another model year shop manual? This looks real similar to the '87 I had in 1989... I wish I still had that shop manual. My Hanes is too new.


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PostPosted: Sat Jun 29, 2013 1:27 pm 
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Location: Exeter California 93221
reclufan wrote:
Hi, I am looking for the function of a green plastic capped vacuum switch(?)

screwed into the intake manifold called 'gas filter' on vacuum diagram,

and pictured in the '86 sprint smog check list'. the picture is above captioned "Next thing I discovered was the top port on the vacuum manifold was plugged up solid."

I am gluing brass ferules on to replace the plastic nipples I broke off. Is this an available part? What is it's name. Can I use another model year shop manual? This looks real similar to the '87 I had in 1989... I wish I still had that shop manual. My Hanes is too new.


That's one of those parts that are very hard to find. Its a junk yard find in most cases. I have a extra PM for Price if your needing one..

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1985 chevy sprint 5speed 1.0 Mk1 (Blue). 1999 Geo metro 5speed 1.0 (Silver). 2003 XL-7 2.7l V6 AUTO (White). 2005 XL-7 2.7L V6 AUTO (Cobalt Blue). 1996 mercury cougar 4.6 auto (Goldish?). New to the family 1998 VW new Bettle 2.0 5speed (Black) Restord <--- (hers)<---- Gone to a new home. Replaced with 2003 Turbo 1.8T 6speed (black) ... In One 1986 chevy sprint ER (White) In line for a restore <---None runner <---(parts). Thats 7... So I'm under a hood alot... Why? Kuzz we love cars!


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 03, 2013 10:57 pm 
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Location: alabama
Can't remember source, but some time back, I posted a source for an idle up
Actuator I found and presently use on my sprint. That same source had vacuum switches
Just like the kind found. Under our hoods. If you look under my thread about my
86 4 Dr restore, I'm sure I mentioned my parts source.

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Mike
Valley Grande, AL
1986 Sprint plus

Do you maintain a personal fleet like I do?
Why do we do it?
Because it's what we enjoy and because we CAN.
2011 camaro, 2005 Vibe, 2004 camry, 06 Expedition, 87 porsche 911, 86 Sprint plus, 73 gmc 4x4, 69 camaro, 99 Gl1500 Goldwing, 12 Kawasaki klr650, 2012 Kubota L3200, and we wont even go into the small stuff.


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 24, 2013 10:34 pm 
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Edit: wrong thread?

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1987 Chevy Sprint base 1.0 3cyl 993cc (R.I.P.)
1986 Chevy Sprint base 1.0 3cyl 993cc (Alive)


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PostPosted: Thu Jul 25, 2013 12:06 am 
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Location: Palm Springs: Too hot from June to Oct.!
bigbadmonster wrote:
Edit: wrong thread?

Not at all.
This is a thread on Hitachi carburetor idle problems.

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DIY Shocks: viewtopic.php?f=10&t=45483
DIY Wheel Align: viewtopic.php?f=2&t=42479
Once you get the cars dialed-in (compression, leaks, bearings, alignment, brakes) swap in new rubber and glass, you've got something which should last for years!


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 30, 2013 12:31 pm 
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Any progress on this issue?

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1985 chevy sprint 5speed 1.0 Mk1 (Blue). 1999 Geo metro 5speed 1.0 (Silver). 2003 XL-7 2.7l V6 AUTO (White). 2005 XL-7 2.7L V6 AUTO (Cobalt Blue). 1996 mercury cougar 4.6 auto (Goldish?). New to the family 1998 VW new Bettle 2.0 5speed (Black) Restord <--- (hers)<---- Gone to a new home. Replaced with 2003 Turbo 1.8T 6speed (black) ... In One 1986 chevy sprint ER (White) In line for a restore <---None runner <---(parts). Thats 7... So I'm under a hood alot... Why? Kuzz we love cars!


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 25, 2013 11:35 pm 
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Location: Arkansas
PROGESS HAS BEEN MADE.
I had to send the carb off to get rebuilt.
I could not find a Sprint Carb specialist around here but it is now running much better.
He said the choke wasn't quite right so it still idles around 2,200 on a cold start but idles down to 900 range and purrs as soon as the temp needle starts to warm up.

***LOOK*** http://teamswift.net/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=57176


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 26, 2013 12:07 am 
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Location: Palm Springs: Too hot from June to Oct.!
2200 cold idle is within factory specs.
There is a complete guide on how to adjust that carburetor within this section.

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DIY Broken Bolt Removal: viewtopic.php?f=22&t=41042
DIY Clutch Adjustment: viewtopic.php?f=9&t=48281
DIY Wheel Bearings: viewtopic.php?f=2&t=29003
DIY Shocks: viewtopic.php?f=10&t=45483
DIY Wheel Align: viewtopic.php?f=2&t=42479
Once you get the cars dialed-in (compression, leaks, bearings, alignment, brakes) swap in new rubber and glass, you've got something which should last for years!


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 26, 2013 7:43 am 
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Location: Palm Springs: Too hot from June to Oct.!
Phil N Ed wrote:
2200 cold idle is within factory specs.
There is a complete guide on how to adjust that carburetor within this section.

And, I've detailed how to adjust the cold idle above.
Did you bother to read some of the posts I made?

Also: post some more 'wide angle' pictures of the car.
That powder coating looks pretty decent.
What size rivets did you use on the air cleaner?

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DIY Broken Bolt Removal: viewtopic.php?f=22&t=41042
DIY Clutch Adjustment: viewtopic.php?f=9&t=48281
DIY Wheel Bearings: viewtopic.php?f=2&t=29003
DIY Shocks: viewtopic.php?f=10&t=45483
DIY Wheel Align: viewtopic.php?f=2&t=42479
Once you get the cars dialed-in (compression, leaks, bearings, alignment, brakes) swap in new rubber and glass, you've got something which should last for years!


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 26, 2013 1:23 pm 
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Phil I salute you.

:salute: :salute: :salute: :salute: :salute:


I've seen numerous post where you gave detailed instructions to OP how to resolve the problem only to be ignored , even if it required minimal effort, determination and basic tools. Makes me wonder why bother .............one of the reasons I mostly keep quiet :|


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 26, 2013 7:40 pm 
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Hey PHIL,
How ya doin?
Read and followed your instructions from top to bottom exactly.
Too exactly actually which is where my story got humerous.
a) print off Phil's instructions
b) read everything and try to take it all end (alot of info)
c) start adjustments as described by Phil exactly.
Roman numberial 2, then 5, then 3.
NOTHING
Going down instructions further: Roman numerial 4, 1
Did I not get the cold adjusted pronto enough as you stated? start over, try again.
Keep following and reading and BAM a few more sections down you state "You cannot adjust the idles...warm, cold, idle up, A/C idle up until that fuel level is correct."
Need to look for the window, and Bubble as you described.
Oh, well let me check that out.
Sure enough no bubble, no hint of a bubble.

When you said that can't be adjusted this without taking the top off the carb I knew I was out of my element.
Made it easy for me to determine I had to send the carb off to get rebuilt.
Long story short: The float shot and a needle valve or something else internal was bad.
Mechanic said it was basically leaking fuel down the throat non-stop at an uncontrollable rate.
=)
When I got the car back and the mechanic told me about the cold idle still being high due to maybe the choke (he is used to working on 800cfm double pump Holleys not highly sophisticated B2), I immediately remembered your post with all the information about the cold idle settings. I couldn't find my printed version which is why I was back on the post to begin with.

I just got the car back and have only drove it like four times so I plan adjusting the cold idle again now that the fuel level is fixed.
:D

i can't remember the rivet size. Their out in the shed and it's cold and dark now. I remember the first size didn't work so I had to pull and move down a size.

I also redid the wiper arms as well; but I have a lot more to go.
I will try to get more pics soon.


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 26, 2013 7:54 pm 
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Hi DTM,
I salute Phil as well.
:salute: :salute: :salute: :salute: :salute: :salute:
I would not have had a clue where to start or what was wrong without him.

I salute you too
:salute: :salute: :salute: :salute: :salute: :salute:
For all the times you have bothered to give advise, whether it was listened to or not.

Please keep giving it, I will listen.
....just do me a favor and list the minor tidbit about "all the things above won't work if"...... before all the things instead of after.
:P
Sorry Phil, just pokin at you.
:lol:
I should have read slower, more thoroughly, and checked that dang bubble thing out first.
=)


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